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Post by ratty on Dec 22, 2022 11:40:19 GMT
[ Snip ] He sounds like a member of our group! Too bad the team he’s speaking to aren’t listening to or capable of comprehending his message. I think it's both.  |
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Post by code on Jan 4, 2023 17:16:43 GMT
Flow Batteries?
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Post by code on Jan 16, 2023 18:19:38 GMT
SJ0004 - Phasing out new electric vehicle sales by 2035.
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Post by nonentropic on Jan 16, 2023 19:21:25 GMT
smart
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Post by ratty on Jan 18, 2023 6:52:16 GMT
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Post by missouriboy on Jan 18, 2023 19:04:18 GMT
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Post by missouriboy on Jan 30, 2023 18:51:57 GMT
Gotta love those Teslas.
Crews put out ‘spontaneous’ Tesla battery fire on California freeway with 6,000 gallons of water
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Post by gridley on Jan 31, 2023 12:13:23 GMT
Gotta love those Teslas.
Crews put out ‘spontaneous’ Tesla battery fire on California freeway with 6,000 gallons of water
I'm surprised CA had 6,000 gallons of water available. |
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Post by missouriboy on Jan 31, 2023 15:20:30 GMT
Gotta love those Teslas.
Crews put out ‘spontaneous’ Tesla battery fire on California freeway with 6,000 gallons of water
I'm surprised CA had 6,000 gallons of water available. They emptied a pub and its patrons.  |
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Post by walnut on Jan 31, 2023 16:40:33 GMT
Gotta love those Teslas.
Crews put out ‘spontaneous’ Tesla battery fire on California freeway with 6,000 gallons of water
When will people come back to reality and accept that a used $5000 Nissan Sentra is a much more practical, economical, and reliable car than any Tesla? Teslas are not user-repairable, and the extremely high cost to keep one going for anything longer the length of your payment schedule makes the whole proposition much worse than untenable. The EV industry is built on poor judgement, the market should stop allocating resources to the entire hair-brained scheme. Not smart. |
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Post by slh1234 on Jan 31, 2023 16:47:14 GMT
All the anecdotes and non-engineering objections aside, EVs continued to grow through 2022, even with challenges like ongoing covid shutdowns of production in Tesla's China plant. Infrastructure continues to be built not just for housing, but also for EVs. More people are buying the objections less and less as more people actually get the chance to drive one, or know someone who owns one and begins to see the back-porch objections for what they are. Younger people in particular, and higher-paid immigrants such as engineering or tech employees from Asia and Europe are more likely to buy EVs, so the objections, while not going away, are being disregarded or just regarded as back-porch swing objections by more and more of the population. Tesla posted new records in 2022: cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/features/tesla-posts-record-sales-in-2022#:~:text=Tesla%20Posts%20Record%20Sales%20in%202022%20More%20%28Getty,2021%20and%20a%20new%20record%20for%20the%20company. Many of the other manufacturers have not yet released complete 2022 figures, but startups like Polestar were on record pace at midyear: www.just-auto.com/news/company-news/polestar-2022-sales-up-80/As I pointed out previously, very little charging actually happens at public charging stations (most is done at home, scheduled for off-peak hours), but still, the graphics in this article about the number of charging stations is pretty interesting, and shows pretty broadly across the world, there is ongoing investment in EV infrastructure: tridenstechnology.com/electric-car-sales-statistics/ (The article says it is on electric car sales statistics, but I found what I referenced to be more interesting). |
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Post by walnut on Jan 31, 2023 16:55:56 GMT
Here are the price ranges for each Tesla model: Model 3 $46,990–$77,990, Model Y $65,990–$86,990, Model S $104,990–$156,990, and Model X $120,990–$160,990.
To produce the $50,000 ~75k that those cars are selling for, MUCH diesel, coal, and gasoline must be burned. In my own case, I own a stone quarry, and I could calculate almost to the penny how many tankers of diesel I will have to burn to come up with that much money. Not "green" at all. Too expensive. Cars needn't cost that much.
And if "green" is not being accomplished, I'd just as soon own an IC engine which I can maintain and repair at a much lower cost.
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Post by slh1234 on Jan 31, 2023 17:01:26 GMT
When will people come back to reality and accept that a used $5000 Nissan Sentra is a much more practical, economical, and reliable car than any Tesla? Teslas are not user-repairable, and the extremely high cost to keep one going for anything longer the length of your payment schedule makes the whole proposition much worse than untenable. The EV industry is built on poor judgement, the market should stop allocating resources to the entire hair-brained scheme. Not smart. Answer to your first question: They won't. Ever. And part of the reason is that it isn't, especially when you get to questions of how people define "practical" or "reliable." "Teslas are not user-repairable" I don't care. I don't work on my car anyway. The simple fact is, there is LESS maintenance to a Tesla than to an ICE car, ESPECIALLY a used car. "extremely high cost to keep one going for anything longer the length of your payment schedule" What are you talking about? Do you have anything empirical to back this up. My Tesla costs almost nothing in maintenance, is cheaper in fuel costs, and the experience of Tesla owners I know show them to continue to run well and reliably well after payments are complete. Additionally, EV owners, and Tesla owners in particular (since there are more of them) are more likely to buy another Tesla than owners of other brands are likely to buy another of those. Maybe you should explore why this is. "much worse than untenable." Hardly. I still own an ICE vehicle at our home in Mexico, but continue with my Tesla in Washington. The only reason I don't own a Tesla in Mexico is because of availability, and Mexico is a bit behind the US in development of all infrastructure. It would be doable, but the cars are just not readily available. Maybe for the next car (if I live that long). "The EV industry is built on poor judgement," This is echo-chamber thinking - not a thought based on experience. "The market" has determined who will buy an EV since nobody in the US, nor in countries like South Korea, have been forced to buy a Tesla. For example, I considered it. I evaluated the experience of others who owned a Tesla. I test drove it. I loved it. My wife wanted it for her business, so we bought it, and used it to haul her consummable for the last couple of years before she retired for good, and we continue to use it. That's a pure market decision, and we have no regrets. " hair-brained scheme." Or, we bought what we wanted, and you don't like that. Sorry, but we're not going to worry. We're going to move one past you, as are other EV owners. "Not smart." Easy to think that when you use fallacies in your other statements to lead to this statement. However; it seems like a smart decision to us. Bottom line is that my Tesla is the most practical and most fun car I have ever owned, and it is not even close. That's my opinion based on my experience, though, and not just opining about something someone is doing that I hope doesn't work. |
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Post by Sigurdur on Jan 31, 2023 17:03:28 GMT
All the anecdotes and non-engineering objections aside, EVs continued to grow through 2022, even with challenges like ongoing covid shutdowns of production in Tesla's China plant. Infrastructure continues to be built not just for housing, but also for EVs. More people are buying the objections less and less as more people actually get the chance to drive one, or know someone who owns one and begins to see the back-porch objections for what they are. Younger people in particular, and higher-paid immigrants such as engineering or tech employees from Asia and Europe are more likely to buy EVs, so the objections, while not going away, are being disregarded or just regarded as back-porch swing objections by more and more of the population. Tesla posted new records in 2022: cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/features/tesla-posts-record-sales-in-2022#:~:text=Tesla%20Posts%20Record%20Sales%20in%202022%20More%20%28Getty,2021%20and%20a%20new%20record%20for%20the%20company. Many of the other manufacturers have not yet released complete 2022 figures, but startups like Polestar were on record pace at midyear: www.just-auto.com/news/company-news/polestar-2022-sales-up-80/As I pointed out previously, very little charging actually happens at public charging stations (most is done at home, scheduled for off-peak hours), but still, the graphics in this article about the number of charging stations is pretty interesting, and shows pretty broadly across the world, there is ongoing investment in EV infrastructure: tridenstechnology.com/electric-car-sales-statistics/ (The article says it is on electric car sales statistics, but I found what I referenced to be more interesting). EV are here to stay. They are great runabouts. They are NOT great work vehicles. |
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Post by slh1234 on Jan 31, 2023 17:09:22 GMT
Here are the price ranges for each Tesla model: Model 3 $46,990–$77,990, Model Y $65,990–$86,990, Model S $104,990–$156,990, and Model X $120,990–$160,990. To produce the $50,000 ~75k that those cars are selling for, MUCH diesel, coal, and gasoline must be burned. In my own case, I own a stone quarry, and I could calculate almost to the penny how many tankers of diesel I will have to burn to come up with that much money. Not "green" at all. Too expensive. Cars needn't cost that much. And if "green" is not being accomplished, I'd just as soon own an IC engine which I can maintain and repair at a much lower cost. When we bought the Model Y for my wife, we needed something to haul her restaurant consummables. We could replace the Hyundai Santa Fe or go with something else. The Santa Fe equipped similar to a Tesla (still not the same, but similar) would have cost about $58K at that time. We paid less than $5K more than that for the Tesla model Y. At $5.00/gallon vs. 9.5 cents KWH, just going by ratings, it cost nearly 16 cents/mile just for fuel for the Santa Fe. It is less than 3 cents/mile in fuel costs for the Tesla. If all we considered was just fuel costs, then the intercept for the difference to be repaid is a little more than 38K miles. However; there is a lot more than just that to consider because we would have oil changes, transmission service, tune-ups, etc. with the Santa Fe, and just on oil changes, even if it is paid for in the service contract at purchase, it still costs us time - maybe an hour each time if we have to take it to a dealer. You can calculate all you want, but that is the economics in our case, and it doesn't even take into account that neither of us particularly liked to drive before we got the Tesla, but the Tesla really restored the fun in driving for us. The bottom line is we LIKE to drive it, but we have people constantly coming up with nonsense NOT based on their experience trying to tell us why we shouldn't drive one. It's silly, and it makes absolutely no sense to me. |
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